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Introducing myself - trying this as a daily driver

Last updated on 21 days ago
N
ntromansJunior Member
Posted 1 month ago

pikewerfer wrote:


(snip)

8. pay the dev for his freelance work - also, keep up the relations, since we might need him to update the browser in the following year, every year (which would then be less work and lower budget need)

(snip)
.


I think this is the key point - it's not so good having a fully working browser that six months later is outdated (just look at the pace at which which Wayfarer updates have to be released). However a new browser is put together, it needs to be able to be quickly and easily updated to the latest version of Webkit (assuming the browser is based on this).

Cheers,
Nigel.
M
miker1264Software Dev
Posted 1 month ago
I think an updated OWB Browser would be great.

I'm willing to donate up to $100 USD for that. If we can find enough donors with interest in the updated browser then we will have enough.
D
deadwoodAROS Dev
Posted 1 month ago
@pikewerfer

If you are willing to take a lead on this, I'd suggest a different approach. Instead of updating Webkit engine in OWB, which is now almost 10 years old, pay the developer of Wayfarer to port it to AROS.

In both cases there are some necessary updates in AROS, like a newer version of GCC, but in my opinion porting an existing up-to-date browser to AROS in an order of magniture easier task than updating Webkit engine from 10-years old version. Additionally, supporting current Wayfarer developer could motivate him to keep the browser updated for both MorphOS and AROS.

What I can commit to in such project is:
- onboard the developer to AROS development process
- be available to answer questions about internals of AROS and help in general with development topics
- update some of the needed components (like the compiler)

Details would have to be discussed between me and the developer.
retrofaza, miker1264, ntromans, mmartinka, Ilbarbax
A
Amiwell79Distro Maintainer
Posted 1 month ago
thank you deadwood for your imput
Edited by Amiwell79 on 16-06-2024 09:26, 1 month ago
A
Amiwell79Distro Maintainer
Posted 1 month ago
A few years ago, I received some responses from the Wayfarer programmer, and he said that he doesn't know Aros, but if someone helps him, he can bring it to his browser
N
ntromansJunior Member
Posted 1 month ago
Having Wayfarer would cover the 'needing regular updating' requirement - i'd say definitely woth a contribution of $100.

Cheers,
Nigel.
Edited by ntromans on 16-06-2024 15:19, 1 month ago
pikewerferpikewerferJunior Member
Posted 1 month ago
@deadwood - well, I know Jacek, the developer of Wayfarer. I can ask him whether he would be willing to collaborate with deadwood and myself to set up a roadmap to port Wayfarer to Aros and then keep updating it for Aros.

I agree, it would be easier and less work to port Wayfarer than to update OWB. However, Jacek is a pragmatist and his priority will always be MorphOS. We would not only need to push the effort to port but then also continue to support him to keep the port alive, otherwise he WILL drop the port again.

Here is what I will do. I will take the lead in this:

I will contact Jacadcaps (Jacek) and ask him if he would be willing.
If jacadcaps agrees, I will organize a video call with deadwood, jacadcaps, me (deadwood, let me know if I should include anyone else).
I will create a sprint board with the epic (port Wayfarer to Aros), so that we can then define stories in our meeting of things we need to do/get done.
Should we decide to include a third dev, I will ask for bounty, collect, recruit, and include that dev into the board, and assign stories to him.
I would also create any follow-up meetings that we decide are necessary.

@deadwood - I will send you a pm with my email address so we can better coordinate this.
Edited by pikewerfer on 18-06-2024 07:33, 1 month ago
A
ASiegelNewbie
Posted 1 month ago

pikewerfer wrote:

I will create a sprint board with the epic (port Wayfarer to Aros), so that we can then define stories in our meeting of things we need to do/get done.

Do you think either Jacek or Krzysztof would need someone else to write JIRA tickets so they stay aware of what needs to be done?

Not to sound snarky but I have to assume they probably didn't do daily stand ups in front of a mirror when they created Wayfarer for MorphOS or Odyssey v1.25 for AROS.

Making hobby projects more like day jobs by adding the usual administrative overhead (and annoyances) but without the same level of financial compensation is not necessarily a way to success.


If the plan was to hire talent outside this community, then more detailed planning would be required. However, the discussed "knowledge transfer" would depend on Krzysztof volunteering a significant amount of his free time to train developers with no intrinsic interest in AROS. This would be time that could be spent on improving AROS instead.

Plus, there would likely be all sorts of inefficiencies (language barriers, vastly different time zones) that complicate matters. This is in addition to the fact that not every developer out there is suited to work on a project like a web browser.
pikewerferpikewerferJunior Member
Posted 1 month ago
@ASiegel thanks for your input. I respectfully disagree: planning something together in a sprint makes things more focused, and having a scrum master who takes care of coordination ensures things stay on track. It gives Devs more freedom.

Having a board and a sprint is ALWAYS beneficial when getting together to plan something. It does not matter whether it is private or professional. I renovated my whole house using Kanban. I assure you we were way ahead of schedule and had saved quite some money by coordinating well.

We might use daily standups. We might not. We might use Scrum. We might use Kanban. This is something that @deadwood and I and Jacadcaps (should he be willing to join) will agree on during the planning phase. It will be a model that all those INVOLVED have agreed on. If Jacadcaps and Deadwood decide that they can do this without any of my help, then I will be fine with that, too.

Respectfully, I believe what we need now is constructive help - not any non-constructive discussion. This community requires an updated browser, and both @deadwood and I are willing to invest time (and, in my case, also money) to get us there. I would appreciate help from all those who are eager to contribute in any way. I would also appreciate those who do not actively contribute to let us do it our way.

Thank You.

I have sent the email to Jacadcaps. Let's hope he is in. Otherwise, we will have to look for an alternative.
Edited by pikewerfer on 18-06-2024 07:32, 1 month ago
M
miker1264Software Dev
Posted 1 month ago
Would we be considering a 64 bit version for AROS x86-64 as well as a 32 bit version for AROS x86? Or just a 32 bit version of the browser?
A
Amiwell79Distro Maintainer
Posted 1 month ago
Pikewerfer

Thank you for the thoughtful initiative, hopefully it goes wellSmile
pikewerferpikewerferJunior Member
Posted 1 month ago
Jacadcaps has replied and is willing to talk to us and do a discovery story to check whether this is possible. A bounty, it seems, will be necessary.

I will now start the conversation between Jacadcaps, Deadwood, and myself. I will keep everyone posted as soon as there is anything to report.
Amiwell79, ntromans
miker1264
A
Amiwell79Distro Maintainer
Posted 1 month ago
GreatSmile Thank you
TemplarioTemplarioJunior Member
Posted 1 month ago
Are there enough AROS users to cover a bounty? because in the other systems the bouties being a failure, although anything is possible and a fan comes and puts in thousands of euros.
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ntromansJunior Member
Posted 1 month ago

Templario wrote:

@Templario - Are there enough AROS users to cover a bounty? because in the other systems the bouties being a failure, although anything is possible and a fan comes and puts in thousands of euros.


That is the question. I thiink once the details are settled this would need to publicised on other Amiga sites to try to pick up as many interested parties as possible.

Cheers,
Nigel.
A
Amiwell79Distro Maintainer
Posted 1 month ago
Surely, amiga-news.de will pop up the news as usual for all those concerning the amiga world.
ArgoArgoNewbie
Posted 1 month ago
The commercial ventures that use AROS could be asked to chip in some money
TemplarioTemplarioJunior Member
Posted 1 month ago

ntromans wrote:

@ntromans -

Templario wrote:

@Templario - Are there enough AROS users to cover a bounty? because in the other systems the bouties being a failure, although anything is possible and a fan comes and puts in thousands of euros.


That is the question. I thiink once the details are settled this would need to publicised on other Amiga sites to try to pick up as many interested parties as possible.

Cheers,
Nigel.

In my case I'm sorry but I not use AROS, now only I am using the AROS One to test my programs in your system, and the bount well, I put money in the Timberwolf for AmigaOS4 and others (when I was user of this system) and well I ended up disappointed with this system, and it's ugly to say it, but be careful with the bounties and the people... that I have been able to see ugly things on AmigaOS4 and also on MorphOS.
A
Amiwell79Distro Maintainer
Posted 1 month ago
on aros there have been many successful bounties including owb and odyssey the sources are available
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Amiwell79Distro Maintainer
Posted 1 month ago
i am willing to make donations for the porting of wayfarer on aros even if i have found alternative solutions with odyssey i am always in the front line for aros
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